PS4

[Brian 972]

Yea well I think you're overestimating them

No, you are underestimating people. The majority of people aren't idiots as you set them out to be. Sony as a company decided to allow people to do what they want with their games, and after seeing the negative response Microsoft received I very much doubt that Sony would do the same, simple business strategy, it put them on top for now and will perhaps keep them there. Online passes only have an issue with multiplayer and they make up the loses from the people who buy online passes separately from the game. Majority of the gaming community is smart enough to know that, and if you don't think so then you're just as much as a dumb ass.

Get off your high horse and shut the fuck up.

On other news...

Games will cost $59.99 like before, if that's really anything big.

[Ku Zi Mu 1194]

The majority of people aren't idiots as you set them out to be

Never said they were. I'm just simply stating that the majority of ppl who buy these consoles are casual gamers, most of whom don't know how the gaming industry works and probably don't care. Most of them won't look into SONY's terms on DRM for themselves. When SONY tells them "You can buy, sell and play used games" all they hear is "You can buy, sell and play used games" I guarantee you most ppl won't take that to the head as long as they probably should.

simple business strategy, it put them on top for now and will perhaps keep them there.

Okay, and? I never argued with that.

Online passes only have an issue with multiplayer

You're missing the point.

Sony as a company decided to allow people to do what they want with their games, and after seeing the negative response Microsoft received I very much doubt that Sony would do the same

Never said they would nor did I ever imply it.

Majority of the gaming community is smart enough to know that, and if you don't think so then you're just as much as a dumb ass.

Ha The irony, I think the word you're looking for is "of".

Get off your high horse and shut the fuck up.

You need to watch your fucking tone and try to get your point across without being such a prick. Your attitude is uncalled for.

I just simply find this all too hard to believe. Publishers hate used games. Why would they publish for SONY when Microsoft is the one giving them what they want? Why would Microsoft make such a shitty decision? How would they profit knowing XBOX ONE sales will suffer because of it? I think this used game issue is going to be the biggest factor this generation.

Ideal situation for SONY: Their position on used games gives them a far larger fanbase than Microsoft giving developers/publishers more $$$ from SONY.

Ideal situation for Microsoft: Microsoft holds on to a fanbase big enough for the developers to make twice as much $$$ from say 500K new game purches with 0 used game purches than they would from 300K new game purches and 400K used game purches.

Maybe I'm missing something here but as of right now that's the way I see it.

There's no argument as to whether or not the PS4 will block used game disc. The question is will the publishers start doing it on their own.

Which would make SONY's position completely moot.

[Brian 972]

The majority of people aren't idiots as you set them out to be

Never said they were. I'm just simply stating that the majority of ppl who buy these consoles are casual gamers, most of whom don't know how the gaming industry works and probably don't care. Most of them won't look into SONY's terms on DRM for themselves. When SONY tells them "You can buy, sell and play used games" all they hear is "You can buy, sell and play used games" I guarantee you most ppl won't take that to the head as long as they probably should.

simple business strategy, it put them on top for now and will perhaps keep them there.

Okay, and? I never argued with that.

Online passes only have an issue with multiplayer

You're missing the point.

Sony as a company decided to allow people to do what they want with their games, and after seeing the negative response Microsoft received I very much doubt that Sony would do the same

Never said they would nor did I ever imply it.

Majority of the gaming community is smart enough to know that, and if you don't think so then you're just as much as a dumb ass.

Ha The irony, I think the word you're looking for is "of".

Get off your high horse and shut the fuck up.

You need to watch your fucking tone and try to get your point across without being such a prick. Your attitude is uncalled for.

I just simply find this all too hard to believe. Publishers hate used games. Why would they publish for SONY when Microsoft is the one giving them what they want? Why would Microsoft make such a shitty decision? How would they profit knowing XBOX ONE sales will suffer because of it? I think this used game issue is going to be the biggest factor this generation.

Ideal situation for SONY: Their position on used games gives them a far larger fanbase than Microsoft giving developers/publishers more $$$ from SONY.

Ideal situation for Microsoft: Microsoft holds on to a fanbase big enough for the developers to make twice as much $$$ from say 500K new game purches with 0 used game purches than they would from 300K new game purches and 400K used game purches.

Maybe I'm missing something here but as of right now that's the way I see it.

There's no argument as to whether or not the PS4 will block used game disc. The question is will the publishers start doing it on their own.

Which would make SONY's position completely moot.

Oops, one simple mistake. Sorry bud. You want irony? Learn to spell "people". Just because you know your losing doesn't mean it's time to point shit out to try and make it look like you're holding an advantage.

When a company makes a game, they sell the game to retailers who then sell that game. The game sold to retailers is $40 for example, but only costs $10 to make. That company makes a $30 profit. When the retailer sells it they jack the price up to $60 to make it competitive and also gain a $20 profit. Either way the company and retailers are making money. Now because retailers are receiving used games at a low price and then selling them for a somewhat higher price you cut out the original company and only the retailer makes an extra profit now. Sure, Microsoft can side with the corporations and try to combat this, but it received such a negative backlash that Sony knew it would get them a place higher. Because Sony is going to be the more popular console this time around as it seems, companies will continue to develop for Sony because if they didn't they would be losing millions of dollars. Both Sony and Microsoft have popular consoles, and that's why the majority of companies publish for both. Exclusives are under contract usually.

When you make it so people can't sell or trade used games you take out an important aspect of a free market. Companies usually make millions upon millions of dollars. The used game thing is bull shit and most people see that.

Lastly, the only way companies can block used game discs on their own is if everyone switches to downloadable content only or they use online passes which only helps half way. There are still ways to get around the downloadable content like license transferring on Xbox or just simply logging into another account on Playstation. Perhaps that may change too but as of now most people who own a console want a physical game and I doubt that aspect will change for a long time because it still has an advantage over the other. People want that physical object, it gives a different experience and sells the best.

[CaPn bOnEs 8527]

stop bitching back and forth, you guys sound like a bunch of whiny teenagers... oh wait...

it's kind of odd to hear sony say 1st party games won't have online passes when uncharted 2, 3, and and last of us shipped with online passes that were required to play online... but the fact is, most of the games on the PS3 will be just like the xbox one when it comes to online passes because publishers are not going to do it on the xbox and not do the same on the PS3... they'd be alienating their own fanbase no matter what console they used... something tells me online passes will be required for all of their 1st party games eventually...

the used game market is huge right now, and it only makes sense that sony still keep that door open considering that we're still many years away from digital only... but sony is really pushing forward the idea of digital downloads too, which also eliminates the used game market, by making all PS4 games available day one, and also with the ability for the new game to download in the background while you launch it... the only way it's gonna convince "hard disc" people from not buying the disc is if they offer day-1 bonuses or pre-order bonuses...

[Rayge 689]

I don't give a shit if you need to have a unique pass to play a game online. The reason people borrow games is usually to play the single player, not to play online.

[Ku Zi Mu 1194]

Just because you know your losing

Stopped reading right here^. Not even because of the improper use of the word "your" but because of the fact that you believe there is something to win or lose. There isn't. Unless you're talking about a flamewar, which I refuse to be apart of.

You use to be cool, Brian.

[Qdeathstar 1763]

You never were cool kuz... Anyone who thinks Sony wont use drm if they think it will increase revenue is naive. Sony can change their policy about drm whenever they want. On the drm issue I'm pretty sure ultimately the only difference between consoles was the pr.

Ofc, the Internet only snafu seems like it was just as well planned out as apple's map app snafu

[Ku Zi Mu 1194]

You never were cool kuz

Thankyou.

[Massacre 7646]

something tells me online passes will be required for all of their 1st party games eventually...

I don't have a problem with this. Online passes are how companies make their money from used games. Buy the game new, you've got an online pass, buy it used, you buy one on PSN or Live. I don't buy games with the intention of playing multiplayer, and I rarely buy pre-owned games. If I do buy a game pre-owned, I'm not doing it for the multiplayer.

You use to be cool, Brian.

No he didn't.

[Ku Zi Mu 1194]

Yes, I know but I was trying to be nice, Massacre.

[CaPn bOnEs 8527]

something tells me online passes will be required for all of their 1st party games eventually...

I don't have a problem with this. Online passes are how companies make their money from used games. Buy the game new, you've got an online pass, buy it used, you buy one on PSN or Live. I don't buy games with the intention of playing multiplayer, and I rarely buy pre-owned games. If I do buy a game pre-owned, I'm not doing it for the multiplayer.

yea i don't have a problem with it either, but people seem to get bent out of shape about online passes... in reality, gamestop is only ever $5 cheaper than retail, which means that paying $10 for an online pass means you just payed $5 more for a used game... i don't even buy used anymore because of that minor price difference...

[DuPz0r 5361]

Well from what Sony have said. Plus is the way of paying for online multiplayer for Ps4. So it's not like you pay a one off pass per game anymore. You're committed to a subscription just like Xbox Gold... I tried PS Plus, and i wasn't overly impressed with it on PS3. The free bits didn't make up for what i spent on it. And the free games were always games i had already spent good money on. I guess paying for Plus and getting multipayer free on all games would be a better deal, especially if "next gen" will be heavily focused on multiplayer games.

[Massacre 7646]

yea i don't have a problem with it either, but people seem to get bent out of shape about online passes... in reality, gamestop is only ever $5 cheaper than retail, which means that paying $10 for an online pass means you just payed $5 more for a used game... i don't even buy used anymore because of that minor price difference...

I buy pre-owned games pretty far down the road. I got LA Noire for $13, Crysis 2 for about the same price. I wouldn't have bought either game for $60, which is the only reason I buy a game pre-owned. If I'm going to replay a game multiple times or I'm going to spend hours playing a single file, I'll buy it new. Pre-owned is for games I probably would never have played had I not been able to get them so cheap.

[CaPn bOnEs 8527]

yea i don't have a problem with it either, but people seem to get bent out of shape about online passes... in reality, gamestop is only ever $5 cheaper than retail, which means that paying $10 for an online pass means you just payed $5 more for a used game... i don't even buy used anymore because of that minor price difference...

I buy pre-owned games pretty far down the road. I got LA Noire for $13, Crysis 2 for about the same price. I wouldn't have bought either game for $60, which is the only reason I buy a game pre-owned. If I'm going to replay a game multiple times or I'm going to spend hours playing a single file, I'll buy it new. Pre-owned is for games I probably would never have played had I not been able to get them so cheap.

most of the time, i can find a game on amazon cheaper so i just buy it from there, including older new games...

[Brian 972]

You use to be cool, Brian.

What the fuck are you talking about, I used to be a proud american. I apologize anyway, not because I think I am wrong on what I was imputing, but for the immaturity on it.

[BlackSox9 448]

Well from what Sony have said. Plus is the way of paying for online multiplayer for Ps4. So it's not like you pay a one off pass per game anymore. You're committed to a subscription just like Xbox Gold... I tried PS Plus, and i wasn't overly impressed with it on PS3. The free bits didn't make up for what i spent on it. And the free games were always games i had already spent good money on. I guess paying for Plus and getting multipayer free on all games would be a better deal, especially if "next gen" will be heavily focused on multiplayer games.

PS Plus is great value for money, I've been using it for the past 2 years and have gotten tons of Free Games, early Betas, free Trials for all games ( 1 hour free game Demo with full access, too see how it plays before you buy it ), discounts for DLC's and games etc,etc. It's significantly better than an Xbox Live Gold Subscription.

Really the only better Game service I can think of ( when it comes to value for money/ and convenience ) is probably Steam. And everyone hated that when it first came out...

[eXo Mirakle 18]

So I was reading about the PS4 specs and I realised that it doesn't have Wi-Fi connectivity. It doesn't effect me badly. I just really thought a next gen console would have it.

[Handsome B Wonderful 331]

Well from what Sony have said. Plus is the way of paying for online multiplayer for Ps4. So it's not like you pay a one off pass per game anymore. You're committed to a subscription just like Xbox Gold... I tried PS Plus, and i wasn't overly impressed with it on PS3. The free bits didn't make up for what i spent on it. And the free games were always games i had already spent good money on. I guess paying for Plus and getting multipayer free on all games would be a better deal, especially if "next gen" will be heavily focused on multiplayer games.

PS Plus is great value for money, I've been using it for the past 2 years and have gotten tons of Free Games, early Betas, free Trials for all games ( 1 hour free game Demo with full access, too see how it plays before you buy it ), discounts for DLC's and games etc,etc. It's significantly better than an Xbox Live Gold Subscription.

Really the only better Game service I can think of ( when it comes to value for money/ and convenience ) is probably Steam. And everyone hated that when it first came out...

Lol, do you work for Sony or something?

I've had plus for the last 6 months, and like Dup, I've already owned most of the free games they've given out. I'd rather have more game discounts and free access to music unlimited (because it sucks and no one should have to pay for it).

Off topic, I've been seriously considering getting a vita to play ps4 games on, but the prices of the memory cards are insane. Until they drop by at least half, I'm not getting one. If they had made it compatible with micro sd cards they would have blown the 3ds out of the water. It amazes me that people are sold on the ps4 so quickly when the vita's release has been such a shambles.

[BlackSox9 448]

Lol, do you work for Sony or something?

I've had plus for the last 6 months, and like Dup, I've already owned most of the free games they've given out. I'd rather have larger game discounts and free access to music unlimited (because it sucks and no one should have to pay for it.

One area the ps4 will need to improve is apps. Useful ones.

No, I don't work for Sony. I'm just trying to provide some facts.

And if you can't see that PS Plus is great value for money, then you must be a fool...

Here is a list of Free PS3 Games ( Euro & US PS Stores ) just going back to about June 2012 ( even though PS Plus started in 2010 ) ~

~ Uncharted 3

~ Red Dead Redemption

~ Batman Arkham City

~ Mass Effect 3

~ Sleeping Dogs

~ Demon Souls

~ Dead Space 2

~ XCOM: Enemy Unknown

~ Infamous 2

~ Battlefield 3

~ Saints Row: The Third

~ Deus Ex: Human Revolution

~ Hitman Absolution

~ Little Big Planet 2

~ Saints Row 2

~ Just Cause 2

~ Crysis 2

~ Vanquish

~ Resident Evil 5

~ Lord of the Rings: War in the North

~ Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning

~ Borderlands

~ Darksiders

~ Bioshock 2 ( very underrated for a solid game )

~ Mortal Kombat

~ Gotham City Imposters

~ Motorstorm Apocalypse

~ Bulletstorm

~ Starhawk

~ Dead or Alive 5

~ Catherine

~ Okami HD

~ Ico & Shadow of the Colossus HD Collection

~ Sly Cooper: Thieves in Time

~ Limbo

~ Ratchet & Clank: All for One

~ Super Street Fighter lV

~ Mega Man 9 & 10

~ Payday: The Heist

~ Lara Croft Guardian of Light ( Tomb Raider Game )

~ Lara Croft & the Guardian of Light ( another Tomb Raider )

~ Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine

~ Retro City Rampage

~ Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath HD

~ Outland

~ The Cave

~ NBA Jam On Fire Edition

~ NFL Blitz

~ Virtua Fighter 5

Plus more, but these are the best...

Notable PSP/Vita Titles~

~ Metal Gear Solid HD Collection

~ Super Stardust

~ Rayman Origins

~ Final Fantasy Tactics

~ Uncharted Golden Abyss

~ Gravity Rush

~ Wipeout 2048

~ Soul Calibur: Broken Destiny

~ Plants Vs Zombies

~ Ninja Gaiden Sigma Plus

~ Chronovolt

~ Unit 13

~ Mortal Kombat

And more, but these are some of the better games.

^^So yeah, not many good games here ....

And in regards to todays news about Microsoft's Backflip on Online DRM and Used Games, it seems that a lot of people have changed their mind about the Xbox One. I can already see this next generation being just as competitive as the last one.

Hopefully the PS4 will keep up with Xbox this time around and do better in the US, Britain and Australia...

[Handsome B Wonderful 331]

Lol, do you work for Sony or something?

I've had plus for the last 6 months, and like Dup, I've already owned most of the free games they've given out. I'd rather have larger game discounts and free access to music unlimited (because it sucks and no one should have to pay for it.

One area the ps4 will need to improve is apps. Useful ones.

No, I don't work for Sony. I'm just trying to provide some facts.

And if you can't see that PS Plus is great value for money, then you must be a fool...

No one in their right mind would say Plus isn't good value, I just think there should be more perks for those who are really loyal to Sony (purchasing a shit ton of ps3 games like myself), because Plus loses its usefulness when you own the majority of free games they offer. Not that there's any point in people cancelling their subscriptions now, as they'll need them to play online with the PS4.

[BlackSox9 448]

No one in their right mind would say Plus isn't good value, I just think there should be more perks for those who are really loyal to Sony (purchasing a shit ton of ps3 games like myself), because Plus loses its usefulness when you own the majority of free games they offer. Not that there's any point in people cancelling their subscriptions now, as they'll need them to play online with the PS4.

You have to admit that PlayStation Plus is better value for money than an Xbox Live Gold Subscription.

Plus what more could you ask for from Sony? Just take a look at all of the free games they've given us over the last year and a half...

[Handsome B Wonderful 331]

Of course. I can't think of one positive thing that comes with a gold subscription. More visible ads?

But enough of that.

I'm interested to see how Gaikai streaming/youtube sharing is going to work in Australia. Unless you're extremely lucky to already have access to the NBN (can I live with you?) your upload speed will be somewhere in the range of poor to up shit creek,so unless there are going to be a bunch of Sony servers located in Australia, I think those features will be worthless. Same goes for rural parts of North America, I suppose.

[CaPn bOnEs 8527]

So I was reading about the PS4 specs and I realised that it doesn't have Wi-Fi connectivity. It doesn't effect me badly. I just really thought a next gen console would have it.

dude, there's no way the new systems won't have wi-fi connectivity... that'd be like going back a gen...

[cuda 939]

Surprising price, almost makes me want to try out video games again.

[DuPz0r 5361]

Lol, do you work for Sony or something?

I've had plus for the last 6 months, and like Dup, I've already owned most of the free games they've given out. I'd rather have larger game discounts and free access to music unlimited (because it sucks and no one should have to pay for it.

One area the ps4 will need to improve is apps. Useful ones.

No, I don't work for Sony. I'm just trying to provide some facts.

And if you can't see that PS Plus is great value for money, then you must be a fool...

Here is a list of Free PS3 Games ( Euro & US PS Stores ) just going back to about June 2012 ( even though PS Plus started in 2010 ) ~

~ Uncharted 3

~ Red Dead Redemption

~ Batman Arkham City

~ Mass Effect 3

~ Sleeping Dogs

~ Demon Souls

~ Dead Space 2

~ XCOM: Enemy Unknown

~ Infamous 2

~ Battlefield 3

~ Saints Row: The Third

~ Deus Ex: Human Revolution

~ Hitman Absolution

~ Little Big Planet 2

~ Saints Row 2

~ Just Cause 2

~ Crysis 2

~ Vanquish

~ Resident Evil 5

~ Lord of the Rings: War in the North

~ Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning

~ Borderlands

~ Darksiders

~ Bioshock 2 ( very underrated for a solid game )

~ Mortal Kombat

~ Gotham City Imposters

~ Motorstorm Apocalypse

~ Bulletstorm

~ Starhawk

~ Dead or Alive 5

~ Catherine

~ Okami HD

~ Ico & Shadow of the Colossus HD Collection

~ Sly Cooper: Thieves in Time

~ Limbo

~ Ratchet & Clank: All for One

~ Super Street Fighter lV

~ Mega Man 9 & 10

~ Payday: The Heist

~ Lara Croft Guardian of Light ( Tomb Raider Game )

~ Lara Croft & the Guardian of Light ( another Tomb Raider )

~ Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine

~ Retro City Rampage

~ Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath HD

~ Outland

~ The Cave

~ NBA Jam On Fire Edition

~ NFL Blitz

~ Virtua Fighter 5

Plus more, but these are the best...

Notable PSP/Vita Titles~

~ Metal Gear Solid HD Collection

~ Super Stardust

~ Rayman Origins

~ Final Fantasy Tactics

~ Uncharted Golden Abyss

~ Gravity Rush

~ Wipeout 2048

~ Soul Calibur: Broken Destiny

~ Plants Vs Zombies

~ Ninja Gaiden Sigma Plus

~ Chronovolt

~ Unit 13

~ Mortal Kombat

And more, but these are some of the better games.

^^So yeah, not many good games here ....

And in regards to todays news about Microsoft's Backflip on Online DRM and Used Games, it seems that a lot of people have changed their mind about the Xbox One. I can already see this next generation being just as competitive as the last one.

Hopefully the PS4 will keep up with Xbox this time around and do better in the US, Britain and Australia...

About 90% of those games i bought myself over the last few years... So that's not really value for money unless you want to wait for the most popular (games that have been bought more times than prostitutes) games to become free two years down the line when not many people are playing them anymore. I'm not defending Microsoft in any way at all btw, as they're doing the exact same thing with Xbox One's Gold Sub, as Sony have been doing for years now. I just wish Sony would give more new games away, or at least the games that haven't done too well on the market. Not platinum titles that only farmers and their mothers haven't played...